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ledge canceling
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06/05/2010, 06:09 PM
(This post was last modified: 06/05/2010 06:09 PM by Rkey.)
Post: #41
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(06/05/2010 04:03 PM)Bleck Wrote:(06/05/2010 04:50 AM)Rkey Wrote: A casual player has no need for ledgecanceling, and the "serious" player will be able to enjoy the game further. Ehm, you mean like they would use shorthops, smashtaunt with CF, ac attacks, space well, do 0-death combos, chaingrab, use bowser ETC. ETC. as in "owning n00bs". Like they don't already? |
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06/05/2010, 06:44 PM
(This post was last modified: 06/05/2010 06:45 PM by TSON.)
Post: #42
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Assuming this casual player has common sense and considers wavedashing as "glitch" and they dont want to abuse "glitchs", they will be able to shorthop and will get mad at people who chaingrab in short, a casual with a brain but no competitive drive who calls competitive players fags |
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06/05/2010, 06:48 PM
Post: #43
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Quote: A serious player will use it against casual players who will have no idea what the hell even just happened to them. You don't actually pay attention to the stigma surrounding fighting games, do you?Wait, wait, wait... we wouldn't add ledge cancelling for the serious players; because it causes the casual scrubs to get raped harder by the serious players? Remove the shield button. A lot of scrubs don't shield enough, and it's unfair when you shield and they don't. Ban ledge guarding, cuz it's cheap and scrubs are bad at it. These are options that only INCREASE the game's depth. I'm not asking to bring back L-cancelling; that doesn't add any depth what-so-ever. It's just a mandatory button press. But ledge cancelling is simply another option, that isn't always the optimal one. Considering this game is meant to be broken, I can imagine people could come up with more creative and entertaining combos with the addition of ledge cancelling. Quote: Or maybe they were just copying it from Melee.And what is inherently wrong with that? Quote: The problem is that you guys are all convinced that these glitches from Melee are important gameplay pieces (and don't try to feed me that 'oh no it was totally intentional' bull unless you've got something to back it up with other than asinine assumptions), whereas the lingering popularity of vBrawl would suggest that these things don't matter at all.Then hitstun doesn't matter. Lower it down to Brawl levels, otherwise we're just copying Melee/64. Just because Melee used it doesn't mean it's a bad addition. I have a question. If you were to JUST play Brawl-, and never played any of the other smash games, which game would seem better, then one with ledge cancelling, which only adds to players options and allows more creativety, or the one without, where you can't be as creative nor do you have as many interesting options for combos? We shouldn't gimp ourselves just for the sake of being different. That is so stupid. Quote: The point of Brawl-, if I recall correctly, was to balance things, not to make the game overly technical again. There's Project: M for that sort of thing.Ledge cancelling doesn't make it overly technical, and it's technical in a good way, anyways. It's not like L-cancelling where your best possible option is to always L-cancel, it's the good kind of technical. The kind that gives you more options as a player, since ledge cancelling may not always be the ideal option. It makes you have to make more decisions. And, no, if the only goal of Brawl- was to balance it, then we'd just go play stupid ass Balanced Brawl. The point of Brawl- was to make the game broken, and balance itself in the process. The addition of ledge cancelling only increases depth, and doesn't make the game overly technical. I don't see any logical reason to not include it. Saying "hurr durr scrubs are bad at it and we don't want them to get raped too hard" is completely ridiculous. Maybe we should bring back random tripping, so that scrubs don't get raped by our superior combos (due to being more technical) as badly. Or maybe we should just scrap the game and play Rock Paper Scissors, instead. It takes almost no tech skill, you know, and scrubs would only lose if they're predictable. Adding extra, non required but good to have, tech skill isn't inherently a bad thing, nor is taking things from Melee. And gimping ourselves so that scrubs don't get raped too hard by better players, or for the sake of originallity instead of quality, is just plain stupid. |
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06/05/2010, 07:03 PM
(This post was last modified: 06/05/2010 07:07 PM by TSON.)
Post: #44
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Quote:And, no, if the only goal of Brawl- was to balance it, then we'd just go play stupid ass Balanced Brawl. The point of Brawl- was to make the game broken, and balance itself in the process.And that's where you got yourself. Where did we say that we wanted the game to be overly competitive or technical? We didn't. Because we don't want to be like the other two Brawl hacks in that sense, because we don't want to piledrive casuals into the floor. At the same time we don't want to kick competitives in the balls. THIS IS WHY I DO NOT LIKE IT WHEN PEOPLE DISCUSS THE GCT. THIS THREAD RIGHT HERE. I've said this at least FOUR times and NOBODY read it. THIS GAME IS MEANT TO BE BROKEN AND FUN. AND BALANCED. IT APPEALS TO BOTH CASUALS AND COMPETITIVES. WE NEED A BALANCE. ADDING TECHNICAL STUFF FURTHER WIDENS THE DIVIDER BETWEEN COMPETITIVE AND CASUAL. Give me something that casuals AND competitives would both enjoy and we'll consider it. Otherwise, leave the GCT to the backroom, because so far, nobody seems to understand that casuals exist even though they aren't on here. We DO discuss these things from time-to-time you know. It does come up. All of your opinions have been considered and evaluated. There are no good points given by any of you that nullify or even come close to contending the bolded statement above. If you think you have one that does, PM me and I will see if it's worth unlocking this topic. *lock* P.S. Yes, I'm the only brawl- forum mod that does anything, it's natural that you can push my buttons faster than you would if someone helped me. I am also the only backroom member that posts regularly outside of the backroom in this section. It may seem like I am trying to exert my authority over you; I am not. Please remember that I am speaking on behalf of the whole backroom AND all of the backroom build playtesters when I speak on issues like this, so do not accuse me of such. |
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