You do realize that if you hold down X, you won't DJC?
As far as PK Freeze goes... well, it breaks shields? I don't like it either. However, what you're suggesting breaks the ever-loving shit out of it.
There is so much wrong with that post. I'd tear it apart but it's sooooo long.
So I'll just say this:
PK Thunder; get used to it. And I have absolutely no clue how he stalled if it makes you fall after 2 fails. :/
PK Fire; it's one PK fire. It just hits a bajillion times. And we can't change the angle. Not possible.
PK Freeze; use it to fuck peoples recoveries or break shields or use it when you're about to be hit and make it run into the ground where your foe is.
PSI Magnet; I don't like any of those ideas other than stun :/
Dsmash; no, that would get wrecked by DI.
(05/17/2010 12:49 AM)The Cadet Wrote: [ -> ]You do realize that if you hold down X, you won't DJC?
As far as PK Freeze goes... well, it breaks shields? I don't like it either. However, what you're suggesting breaks the ever-loving **** out of it.
FFFFF... all this time... I assume you mean whatever button's assigned to jump, right? though I'm going to need to change my controls. Not easy to hold X/Y and C-Stick at the same time on a Classic.
PK Freeze: Ah, so it breaks shields. That's all I'm missing, then? I guess that's broken... not as flashy as everyone else, but whatever... I'm going to want to see a good video of this in action, though. Also, I'm not sure if you mean it breaks it in a good way or bad way. I'm leaning towards bad. Not all of it has to be implemented.
(05/17/2010 03:12 AM)TSON Wrote: [ -> ]There is so much wrong with that post. I'd tear it apart but it's sooooo long.
So I'll just say this:
PK Thunder; get used to it. And I have absolutely no clue how he stalled if it makes you fall after 2 fails. :/
PK Fire; it's one PK fire. It just hits a bajillion times. And we can't change the angle. Not possible.
PK Freeze; use it to **** peoples recoveries or break shields or use it when you're about to be hit and make it run into the ground where your foe is.
PSI Magnet; I don't like any of those ideas other than stun :/
Dsmash; no, that would get wrecked by DI.
Don't bother tearing it apart. I'd like to point out that "In my opinion..." I used way up there.
PK Thunder: Please excuse this "get used to it" logic. Is it sheer lethargy, inability, or apathy towards editing it that makes just dealing with the way currently is such a MARVELOUS idea?
PK Fire: 'k. You're serious on the momentum thing, though? Could've swore there was a PSA event for it.
PSI Magnet: Well do something with stun, then. It's barely minusificated. :/
DSmash: Then make it so if it's not wrecked by DI, you get wrecked. Just a few repositionings of the hitboxes. Or maybe being able to cancel it after the first hit. I don't know, your ideas of broken and mine differ too much and seem to be nerd-fight fuel. :l
finally actually played a little of Brawl-, its fun. I'll just say i'd like Lucas to be looked at again for reasons mentioned in this thread. I feel like he's getting left behind after I played as some of the other characters.
that's all i'll say.
(05/17/2010 04:47 AM)Muhznit Wrote: [ -> ]PK Thunder: Please excuse this "get used to it" logic. Is it sheer lethargy, inability, or apathy towards editing it that makes just dealing with the way currently is such a MARVELOUS idea?
Big words don't solidify your case. Let's simply say that just because two people, of the TWO THOUSAND that downloaded minus, complained about something, and did not attempt to cope with it, I should change it? Reality check anyone? Why should I change something because you find it strange and haven't attempted to master it? It's not even that flipping hard. I see this happen soooo many times it's aggravating.
(05/17/2010 04:47 AM)Muhznit Wrote: [ -> ]PK Fire: 'k. You're serious on the momentum thing, though? Could've swore there was a PSA event for it.
Not one that works on articles.
(05/17/2010 04:47 AM)Muhznit Wrote: [ -> ]PSI Magnet: Well do something with stun, then. It's barely minusificated. :/
It has JC as soon as the hitbox comes out, doesn't it?
(05/17/2010 04:47 AM)Muhznit Wrote: [ -> ]DSmash: Then make it so if it's not wrecked by DI, you get wrecked. Just a few repositionings of the hitboxes. Or maybe being able to cancel it after the first hit. I don't know, your ideas of broken and mine differ too much and seem to be nerd-fight fuel. :l
What exactly is wrong with trip -> meteor smash -> outward hit true combo?
(05/19/2010 02:29 AM)TSON Wrote: [ -> ]Big words don't solidify your case. Let's simply say that just because two people, of the TWO THOUSAND that downloaded minus, complained about something, and did not attempt to cope with it, I should change it? Reality check anyone? Why should I change something because you find it strange and haven't attempted to master it? It's not even that flipping hard. I see this happen soooo many times it's aggravating.
u mad?
"Lethargy" isn't big. It's just fancy. But I'll try to stick to words under two syllables just for you then, if it angers you so much. Anyway, don't think I'm forcing you to change the current way PKT works, I'm just posting in a SUGGESTION topic. Really, is it so much trouble to have manual over automatic second PKT?
(05/19/2010 02:29 AM)TSON Wrote: [ -> ]Not one that works on articles.
I meant giving Lucas more of a boost. You fire it right, he moves left. I suggested adding some vertical height to that.
(05/19/2010 02:29 AM)TSON Wrote: [ -> ]has JC as soon as the hitbox comes out, doesn't it?
Does not seem to. I downloaded the Beta version of Brawl-, so I should have the right Lucas. You may be thinking of Ness who's wallowing in his own awesomeness compared to Lucas right now.
(05/19/2010 02:29 AM)TSON Wrote: [ -> ]What exactly is wrong with trip -> meteor smash -> outward hit true combo?
Same thing that's wrong with a manual second PKT. I was simply posting my .02 USD on having Lucas's DSmash hits moving around.
PKT may seem offsetting and surprising to a casual player, but if you take just a few minutes in training mode, and use different recovery angles, it really is as easy as "get use to it" or rather, more practically, "practice using it."
PK Fire should just have a magnet cancel upon release. 'Lets him use the move with more safety and recover more easily out of it.
PK Freeze should be given about twice the hitlag, if not more, and half the SDI capability. Or be removed/changed/fixed in its entirety.
Now time for my thoughts on Lucas's needs.
Lucas is primarily a momentum based character in any of version of Brawl, and that momentum should carry over to - as well. Lucas needs a way to us the momentum boosts he gets from his attacks and AT's. His Dash attack and F-tilt already allow him to do this on the ground, but he is lacking any crazy horizontal air flings. Instead Lucas gets... A fast DJC that looks more like something from Melee Yoshi. Now, it's fine if Lucas keeps this tech since it is indeed very useful, but he needs other, more relevant cancels as well.
My suggestion is allowing interrupt on aerial PK Fire for PSImag and aerials, and allowing interupt on PSImag for aerials.
On the ground, PK Fire should allow interrupt for magnet, and magnet should allow interrupt for Jump.
These two uses for the moves would allow for make-shift AT's that cause Lucas to toss himself horizontally while having a wide assortment of options at his disposal. You see, I love interrupts on mobile, but I am not a fan of allowing anything to interrupt an action. I like to see certain actions chain together in free-form while still retaining a level of unpredictability and options. Allowing these two moves to interact as they would with each other and with aerials gives Lucas a lot of coverage and keeps him within a few lines.
I'm sleepy now. So until the morrow and twilit, au revoir and byebeeee >w< ~
Actually, I think I could get on board for PK Fire cancellable with psi magnet for a ridiculous magnet pull. Not that Lucas needs it for recovery, he's got enough of that already, but more for absurd chasing, which would still make him rather unique. Chasing off of a smash? Sounds great.
^^Yes I like and agree with everything said by Kink-Link
If you didnt notice, the magnet cancel out of PK fire is like 30 frames faster.
(05/20/2010 04:55 PM)TSON Wrote: [ -> ]If you didnt notice, the magnet cancel out of PK fire is like 30 frames faster.
That's really cool.
Lucas should get psi-m iasa, at any point, into jump/pk-fire. The things he would pull off with that would be unbelievable. Wavebounce psim cancel fakeouts, crazy djc followups, better pseudo wavedashing, recoil shenanigans, a really versatile aerial movement technique (think of characters with cancelable b-reversable moves). This would be amazing. I think I'd play B- just for that.
With PK-Freeze it would be a good idea to modify the momentum properties it has. Shorter faster zapjump with pkfreeze (which is double jump-cancelable right?) would be pimp. Fast enough for it to allow for insane vertical chasing.
You'd have several really cool techniques for chasing, recovering, spacing and looking bad***.
That...sounds sexy.
Consider it done (until Kirk nerfs it?)
If you can get me the lucas .pac when this is ready I'll test it up and make a poor quality but sexy-as-**** video of me showing off with recoil specials.
I've messed around with Lucas a bit, but nothing extensive. Has there been any drastic change to Bair that I haven't noticed?
*Edit*
You know, once I had a match vs comp Wario, and I managed to grab the wariobike while sliding from Lucas's dash attack and throw it... it was like a glidetoss. 0.0
Down B work like snakes nikita missile
edit: or have it just stay in place where you activated it till you press down b again
How would a... a force ball held at lucas's feet work like Snake's missile?
How about making it so PK Freeze actually does something?
It did. But it... got Kirked.
Is that an accidental kind of Kirked, or an intentional kind of Kirked? I really hope it isn't the latter, since that would imply he has some sort of deep-seated resentment for even the vBrawl version of PK Freeze. Surely leaving it unchanged is better than making it absolutely useless?
Iirc we were gonna do something with it but forgot. its still pretty useful for annoying people lol